I would change the wording on the image below to, “Oh what we CAN be…” instead of, “Oh what we COULD be…”

For all Christians, there is an on-going struggle between the flesh and spirit that is often a daily reality.

Therefore, which of these two natures is the real me? More specifically, what does this inner conflict mean for the person leaving homosexuality?

For every Christian, overcoming his or her past – whether it is homosexuality or some other life-dominating struggle – is an on-going process of spiritual growth. In some respects, it never ends. The transformation of anyone struggling with same-sex attraction is a maturing experience similar to that of any believer. The journey out of the brokenness of same-sex attraction is not unique at all. It just has different twists and turns along the way from that of the average heterosexual seeking healing from his or her past.

Without a doubt, stopping homosexual acting out is a significant, important first step. But what then? One of the deepest root issues that every man and woman must change in order to experience freedom from his or her homosexual background is change in thoughts and identity.

Identity – the core sense of who we are – is the probably the deepest and most difficult area to experience change. This is where Scripture can have its most powerful effect. Am I defined by my feelings or by whom God says I am?

Every former homosexual that I have met has repeatedly told me that the reason they have been successful in abandoning homosexuality has been solely due to obedience to God’s Word. Changing their same-gender attraction was a side effect of a much larger goal: being conformed to the image of Jesus Christ.

Many men and women have found homosexuality to be ultimately disappointing and less than totally fulfilling. Many have sensed that there is something more available, and they want it. However, seeking a ‘straight lifestyle’ is a flawed and misdirected motive for coming out of homosexuality. The ultimate goal and focus should be seeking and reaching spiritual maturity, and not just experiencing a certain sexual orientation.

There is evidence for change from homosexuality right in the New Testament church. In speaking to the Corinthian believers, the Apostle Paul said that some of them had been involved in various sinful lifestyles, including homosexuality. But then he declared, “And that is what some of you were. But you were washed, you were sanctified, you were justified in the Name of the Lord Jesus Christ and by the spirit of our God.” (1 Corinthians 6:11)

Coming out of homosexuality is not a new phenomenon. It has been occurring in the Church since the days of first-century church – if not before. The message of hope for overcoming same-gender attraction has been declared for centuries. With that in mind, I hope you will find the following testimonies encouraging and thought-provoking. To God be the glory!

“I am amazed at the change in me. Other people see it as well. Yes, I still experience temptation from time to time, but I now have the strength and the desire to turn away from it. I am so filled with compassion to help others who have the same issue of same-sex attraction that I can’t explain it. I know that it is the Holy Spirit at work in me. I know that I am just a babe in Christ and that I must grow in knowledge and maturity. I wait patiently for the time to come when God calls me to help. I pray daily He will use me to help others. I want to thank you so much for His Way Out Ministries. It is a truly needed ministry in this world. I wish the Church would face this issue more directly and speak of it openly and remove the stigma it has associated with it. I just feel like so many people could be helped more easily. May God bless your ministry.” Mike

“It was truly God’s plan and blessing that His Way Out Ministries was here in Bakersfield, California just when I needed healing and restoration. You devoted an enormous amount of time, love and understanding to me and I appreciate it and still do appreciate it. You made a positive impact not only on my life but the life of my wife and children. When we all see each other in Glory, you will be able to see how many generations you affected. I praise God for His Way Out Ministries. Please, please, please never be disheartened or discouraged. You are a conduit of God’s love.” Jim

“I asked Jesus to fully invade my heart and rescue me. I would love to tell you that there was an immediate surge of electricity throughout my body or there was a mighty gush of the Holy Spirit upon me, but that is not how God worked with me. That said, there was an undeniable peace in my heart. The events that followed are nothing short of miracles especially after all the bridges I had burned. I called my parents who helped me get into a Christian drug program in Vista, CA and after about four months of being sober, I began to become truly convicted of my same-sex attraction. My mom, a seasoned prayer warrior, had been in prayer all these years and hunting down any and all ministries for those who struggle with same-sex attraction. She began sending me articles and newsletters from Pastor Lee and His Way Out Ministries with the content just making sense. Finally, I wasn’t alone and I began to see and understand my true struggle wasn’t my drug abuse. For the past eight years, I have been rebuilding my life and learning how to have a relationship with God. It hasn’t been without its trials or its joys. Ultimately, you do not have to surrender to a lie. You have to surrender to God.” Kenny

Ministering to men, women and their families is a joyous opportunity to share in the comfort that Christ has given to all of us. It says in 2 Corinthians 1:3-5, “Praise be to the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of compassion and the God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our troubles, so that we can comfort those in any trouble with the comfort we ourselves have received from God. For just as the sufferings of Christ flow over into our lives, so also through Christ our comfort overflows.”

From All of Us at His Way Out Ministries…

To each of you who continually bless us by your encouragement, ministry participation, financial support, offerings, and prayers, we remain truly grateful. Bless you, for enabling us to reach around the world with the message of hope, healing, and transformation in Christ Jesus.

His Way Out Ministries Podcasts are dedicated to equipping, educating, and encouraging the Body of Christ to reach out and minister to individuals, families, and churches impacted by the brokenness of same-sex attraction.

For many years, the crisis of truth we have faced and the on-going crisis is ultimately not about homosexuality. “The crisis” is the Lordship of Christ and the Authority of Scripture.

“I will praise your name for your loving kindness and your truth, for you have magnified your word above your name.” Psalm 138

Listen online or download the podcast.

Homosexuality: A Crisis of Truth with Pastor Phillip Lee – Download MP3 –

America continues what I believe is a radical social experiment, the redefining of marriage. Ultimately, it’s not about whether or not gays and lesbians are nice people or good citizens. Frankly, some are and some aren’t, just like heterosexuals. It’s not about whether gays and lesbians can be good, nurturing, loving parents. It’s not even about whether or not gays and lesbians should be treated with respect and dignity. Every person deserves to be treated with respect and dignity.

Since we have redefined marriage to include same-sex marriage, is there any logical reason for us not to redefine marriage in other ways? There are those that demand equality that promote polygamy or group marriage. If marriage can be redefined to include two men or two women, why not allow marriage between a man and four women, or a group of six or seven adults and their various children?

Today, a popular error that has been made and continues to be made by many, is the attempt to blur the lines with regard to Christian ethics making “love” an omnipotent spiritual quality which has the power to validate anything that is done in its name. Under this particular line of thinking, one could justify any type of relationship, including those considered unacceptable and incompatible with Christian teaching and conduct.

Is the perceived or even real presence of love the criterion for all relationships? Indeed, God is love – absolutely. But true love has boundaries that protect, guide and show concern for its recipients. Ultimately, showing support for, and more importantly, standing upon The Authority of Scripture “for marriage between one man and one woman” is not intolerant. If so, then nature itself would be intolerant. Marriage was established by God Himself and as a result, cannot be redefined by each new generation.

Within the same-sex marriage experiment, lesbian mothers are saying that a father is irrelevant to parenting; homosexual fathers say that a mother is irrelevant to parenting. But God says both a mother and a father are relevant to parenting. Is anyone truly serious in suggesting that two men can take the place of a mother’s love, or two women can equal a dad?

Today, especially in America, the words “intolerant” and “discrimination” are powerful words and often used to squash any opinion about moral behavior. In fact, not only is the demand today to keep our opinions to ourselves as to what people do, the equal demand is to affirm a long list of various lifestyles no matter how questionable or experimental.

Compassion, communication, and care must be exercised with regard to the same-sex marriage experiment. The enormous problem in American society is the frequent usage of our experience as a basis to interpret reality. Far too many think, I’m having this experience and enjoying it, so God Himself in particular and society as a whole had better jump on-board, get used to it and fit in around with what I’m doing. Do we as a society really have the right to redefine marriage so it is elastic enough to include any grouping of adults?

In the face of what is arguably one of the most damaging social experiments to ever be attempted in this country, the notion of a family with a father, mother, and children, all living under the same roof, appears to be becoming a relic of a bygone era, at least in some quarters.

Gay marriage advocates will tell you that what children really need is two loving adults in their lives and that the sex of those adults doesn’t matter – the assumption being that mothers and fathers are interchangeable and optional. Our ultimate preference should always be a family comprised of one father and one mother. We cannot, we must not wrest children from the God-given format of family relationship without considering the possibilities of serious consequences.

Admittedly, a society, a compassionate society should always come to the aid of motherless and fatherless families. That said, a compassionate society should never, ever, intentionally create motherless and fatherless families. And that’s exactly what the experiment of same-sex marriage does.

Pastor Phillip Lee
Executive Director
His Way Out Ministries

Nancy Schultz, a friend of many years, sent me this picture taken in 1985. While I do not know the exact date the picture was taken, I do know it wasn’t too long after surrendering my life to Christ Jesus.

We, (left) Nancy Schultz, my mother, Roma, me and Nancy’s dad, Bob.

We are standing in the church parking lot sharing a cup of fellowship. Yep, it was most definitely quite some time ago because I had dark hair!

Ah, yes, Church.

For years I have had a practice when speaking in a church or conference to eventually make my way to the back of sanctuary or auditorium, look toward the front and think to myself – “This is good. This is decent. This makes sense.”

The years I lived as a gay-identified man within the gay communities of Los Angeles, San Francisco, and New York City produced anything but a good, decent, and sense-filled life. The futility of homosexual practice enabled and produced a false self, a half-person, and left me with a perpetual question mark.

Ultimately, it was the Church that helped me to face reality honestly, compassionately and courageously. With time, a sense of value, a sense of being loved and accepted, and a sense of living a meaningful life produced the best value of all – human well-being.

Honesty requires I acknowledge there were times of moving into my new life, my new identity and a new community that was by no means easy. Thankfully and gratefully, within the process, I received an abundance of wise counsel, encouragement and support.

Today, if I allow myself to look back, I marvel at how easily I became consumed by and locked into a false identity not knowing and realizing I was hopelessly and endlessly searching for “me” in all the wrong places.

The Church that surrounded me treated me with dignity and respect while at the same time being abundantly clear in stating and showing me from Scripture that homosexual behavior is just one of the forms human fallenness can take with divine forgiveness and restoration available to all that surrender to the Lordship of Christ.

To this day, I remain grateful to the Church for helping me to distinguish between healthy and unhealthy desires. It is a fact that truth can hurt, if not cut deeply, before it heals. However, truth offered and presented compassionately is more than liberating. When truth becomes known, and acted upon, truth frees.

Yes, indeed, Church is good, decent, and makes sense. Where I came from made no sense whatsoever. Truth and reality dictate that until each person comes to grips with this central ethical question – whether and why anything is either right or wrong – they will wander needlessly, hopelessly, and God forbid, disastrously adrift.

To speak the truth in love is not to condemn the one to whom it is spoken. Truth is good, truth is decent, truth makes sense and will defend itself.

“Let love be without dissimulation…” (Romans 12:9).

I remain grateful the Church spoke truth to me.

Pastor Phillip Lee

“Restoration comes when you realize the light at the end of the tunnel is NOT a train!” (Lessons learned from the pit. Ugh!)

Today, often caught in the middle of the emotional conflict regarding “change” is the person who struggles with unwanted same-sex attraction. To him, (and I use the pronoun generically for both men and women) the issue of change is more than just an issue of emotional debate. It strikes at the very core of his being, either bringing hope or despair.

The Oxford American Dictionary defines change as to make or become different; to pass from one form or phase into another. Certainly, for any individual the greatest change is to become a Christian and know that your ultimate eternal destination has been changed from hell to heaven; to become born-again.

Having been around the phenomenon of change for quite some time, I am convinced that much of the conflict regarding same-sex attraction and change comes from a misunderstanding of the meaning of change. Redemptive changes occur in all healing, restoration process, our past involvement in sinful behavior, and what it was that pushed us toward the particular sin in the first place. With same-sex attraction, it is no different. The contributing factors to a person having an issue with same-sex attraction are numerous and complex. However, that does not minimize God’s power and sovereignty, nor does it change the undeniable biblical evidence that God can change the life of a person involved in homosexuality. Homosexuals have been experiencing change since the Bible was written. (1 Corinthians 6:9-11)

It occurred to me early on in my new life in Christ Jesus that the Gospel never once stated “come as you are and stay as you are” but rather “come as you are to be restored and transformed.”

Not unlike a multitude of others, I thought (at least to a degree), that a lot of my “stuff” would instantaneously just “poof” and disappear. It didn’t occur to me that I did not arrive at my broken place in life overnight, therefore not everything was going to be resolved overnight. I had programmed deep into my thinking a whole truckload of experiences, activities, and beliefs that were anything but what God had intended. And, nobody pushed the “clear button” when I became a believer. All of that stuff (lies) was recorded in my mind and enabled the strongholds which directly affected how I say myself and others.

And, so, began a process of spiritual growth which continues to this day. I began facing and working through character faults, past hurts, immaturities, and a list of insecurities. You know, stuff! Often taking life disappointments and broken dreams to Jesus. Only He truly knows the answers to your problems.

One of the biggest and highest hurdles I first had to face down was the admittance I needed to make changes. Frankly, having to admit I needed to change was pretty tough since I could recall having same-gender attraction for as long as I could remember, and those feelings and emotions ‘felt’ natural. Ultimately, the admittance change is needed and necessary translated to “there’s something wrong with the way I am and the way I live.” You know, that’s a huge blow to one’s ego especially when you come to the realization that the changes needed cannot be accomplished alone.

I would definitely equate leaving homosexuality as comparable to submitting to major spiritual surgery. Bam! Instantaneously, your whole identity becomes absolute turmoil. That should not be so surprising since anytime we make a change in our behavior, it is usually because the pain involved in that behavior far outweighs the pleasure. Maybe you noticed like I did many, many years ago – while we know intellectually we must make a change, our feelings do not necessarily follow – men and women that say goodbye to homosexuality or lesbianism, experience grief, disorientation, and confusion. This is because someone we have known, been well acquainted with for a long, long time, is now dying. It is perfectly understandable the loss impacts our life and we grieve.

How well I remember launching out into the very, very uncomfortable dimension of the restoration process by opening up and placing under the Holy Ghost microscope, old, unresolved wounds. Ugh! I hated “going there” but I also understood that to implement necessary changes in my life necessitated retracing certain steps that enabled me to arrive at such a desperate place in life. Identifying painful situations that enabled the brokenness of same-sex attraction and working through them is just part of the whole process.

I am often asked, “Why do some make it out of homosexuality while others don’t?” I am convinced the common denominator among the men and women that have experienced a significant change in their lives involved the consideration of total surrender and control in their lives. In other words, nothing short of total commitment to the will of God (despite feelings, emotions, hormones, temptations, etc.) holds the same-sex attracted individual to the discipline needed for change. Ultimately, it is the individual’s decision and follow-through of putting God on the throne of his or her life instead of self.

Freedom, change, healing, restoration only occurs when we look upward to Jesus and are purposed to enter more deeply into fellowship with Him. As our Creator, God is the only one who knows exactly how to restore us and bring about change.

“I tell you the truth, unless a kernel of wheat falls to the ground and dies, it remains only a single seed. But if it dies, it produces many seeds. The man who loves his life will lose it, while the man who hates his life in this world will keep it for eternal life.” (John 12:24-25 NIV)

Here’s a thought. When an individual who was once controlled by his or her sin is now free from that sin and engaged in a new kind of life pattern, hasn’t change occurred?

One day (I remember this so well), I had one of those “Ah-Ha!” moments. It finally hit me after a very, very long period of time that I was most definitely a “guy” that just happened to have different interests, gifts, and talents that did not necessarily match the abilities, gifts, and talents of others. No gender confusion, just gifts God had granted me and placed within me to ultimately honor and glorify Him. I have heard it said, “Fear is the darkroom where negatives are developed.” Boy had I bought into a truckload of negatives about myself.

Thank you, Jesus, for leaving the light on for me to find my way out of the negatives and darkness.

Oswald Chambers states in My Utmost for His Highest, “A man is a slave for obeying unless behind his obedience there is recognition of a Holy God.” I find it remarkable that God never insists on our obedience, but when we truly know Him, we want to instantly obey Him, change, and live according to His perfect will from sunup to sundown.

To this day, I thank God I did not become a Christian to leave homosexuality. I became a Christian because Jesus just made sense. Heaven knows, where I came from and what I was doing made absolutely no sense whatsoever.

Today, I continue to find that God will take me as far as I am willing to go. The path of healing from same-sex attraction comes about only through a genuine and intimate relationship with Jesus Christ. The addiction and bondage to homosexuality can be broken. I say “can be” because Jesus has given us free will. The essential first step is wanting Christ and all that He offers.

The only remedy for any lie you may have embraced or bought into about yourself or homosexuality is to confront it with truth, His truth.

Pastor Phillip Lee
Executive Director
His Way Out Ministries

“If I profess with the loudest voice and clearest exposition every portion of the truth of God except precisely that little point which the world and the devil are at the moment attacking, then I am not confessing Christ, however boldly I may be professing Christ. Where the battle rages, there the loyalty of the soldier is tested.” Martin Luther

Pastor Phillip Lee and His Way Out Ministries present Season Four; Episodes 12 through 21 Audio Podcasts originally broadcast live on KERI 1410AM Radio in Bakersfield, CA

All 4 Seasons and 91 Episodes of 30-minute broadcasts are dedicated to equipping, educating, and encouraging the Body of Christ to reach out and minister to individuals, families, and churches impacted by the brokenness of same-sex attraction.

Listen online or download all 10 Episodes.

Scripture and Sexual Expression with Will Wynn pt1, Audio Podcast S04E12
Scripture and Sexual Expression with Will Wynn pt2, Audio Podcast S04E13
Pastor Phillip Lee is joined by ordained minister, fried, and partner of His Way Out Ministries, Will Winn to discuss, Scripture and Sexual Expression. What do we know about homosexuality, scripturally-speaking? Pastor Phillip and Will take a journey through a variety of Scriptures that speak clearly with regard to homosexuality. Genesis Chapters 1 and 2, Matthew 19:4-6, and Romans 5:12-19, just to name a few, clearly define that God’s divine intent for human sexuality has very clear holy boundary lines regarding sexual expression.

A Crisis of Authority with Pete Baker pt1, Audio Podcast S04E14
A Crisis of Authority with Pete Baker pt2, Audio Podcast S04E15
Pastor Pete Baker, friend, ministry partner, and Senior Pastor of Fairfax Assembly of God joins Pastor Phillip Lee to discuss,

• Why has the issue of homosexuality remained so divisive to the Church?
• How does God want us to see gay-identified individuals?
• Have too many churches conformed to the standards of the popular culture regarding homosexual practice versus the truth and authority of Scripture?
• Is the Bible inspired and without error in its original delivery to the prophets from God or just a collection of myths and man-made opinions?

Pastor Baker also shares the testimony of his two recent trips to South Korea with emphasis on the dedication, discipline, and power of prayer.

Feelings Don’t Define Your Identity with Angelo Frazier pt1, Audio Podcast S04E16
Feelings Don’t Define Your Identity with Angelo Frazier pt2, Audio Podcast S04E17
Pastor Phillip Lee welcomes Pastor of Outreach & Care at River Lakes Community Church, Angelo Frazier, for a frank discussion touching on feelings and sexual identity. How does God want us to see gay-identified men and women? Is it possible to validate homosexual practice from Scripture? Scripture states clearly that change is possible.

Feelings Are Not The Real You with Wayne Blakely pt1, Audio Podcast S04E18
Feelings Are Not The Real You with Wayne Blakely pt2, Audio Podcast S04E19
Pastor Phillip Lee welcomes Wayne Blakely, Founder and Director of Know His Love Ministries. God defines the difference between right and wrong. And, He has made sexual pleasure to be good…in the context of His moral boundaries set for it. Wayne shares about his 40 years living as a gay-identified man and both offer a response to “Same-sex attraction…Why me?”

Don’t Underestimate The Church with Will Wynn pt1, Audio Podcast S04E20
Don’t Underestimate The Church with Will Wynn pt2, Audio Podcast S04E21
Pastor Philip Lee is joined by friend, ministry partner, and ordained minister, Will Winn, for a frank, open, and honest discussion about the difficulty faced by the Christian Church regarding homosexual behavior. The Church remains God’s vehicle to reach wounded, broken, and hurting humanity, and should not be underestimated in it’s ability to provide answers to the difficult topic of homosexuality.

All past episodes of His Way Out Ministries Radio Broadcast are available by following THIS LINK or selecting the “Audio Podcast” category on the right.